EMERGENCY: fuel pump gasket help! [Archive]

kansei

08-30-2008, 12:27 AM

Now that I found out no RTV can be used near fuel, what are my options?

If I had ordered from the dealership today it wouldn't have gotten there until wednesday (i.e. I'd be halfway across the country by then). No auto parts store can get one sooner than 5 days.

I can't drive my car, it's extremely toxic to be even within 10 feet of the car. I need help!

What can I use for this? It needs to be something I can buy today (Saturday, 30 August 2008) because today (granted probably 20 hours from now) begins the Trans-American Zoom journey. I don't care if it won't last long, but what I do care is that it won't contaminate my fuel or gunk up injectors, the pump, etc.

If you missed the pic I posted in a couple threads on here:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3142/2808978480_c6d6ac9ee4_b.jpg

I can thank the CT DOT for that mess.

Judman13

08-30-2008, 12:37 AM

umm duct tape?? or some sort of epoxy. just throwing out worst case scenario's.

kansei

08-30-2008, 12:41 AM

Permatex® Form-A-Gasket® No. 2 Sealant
Reliable paste-like gasket sealant/dressing/coating. Form-A-Gasket No. 2 sets more slowly to a pliable film best suited for non-rigid, vibrating assemblies. Use to 400˚F (204˚C). Resistant to gasoline and other solvents. Conforms to MIL-S-45180 D. Suggested applications: Coating cut gaskets to improve sealing and hold in place.

Permatex® Form-A-Gasket® No. 1 Sealant
Reliable paste-like gasket sealant/dressing/coating. Form-A-Gasket No. 1 sets quickly to a hard set and is recommended for rigid, permanent assemblies. Use to 400˚F (204˚C). Resistant to gasoline and other solvents. Conforms to MIL-S-45180 D. Suggested applications: Coating cut gaskets to improve sealing and hold in place.

This is one I've heard works..
http://www.acehardwareoutlet.com/(jlegdd55i2dfleav4rhrycye)/ProductDetails.aspx?SKU=88220

if I can find it

the nearest ace hardware is over 45mins from here lame

edit: nevermind, advance auto parts apparently carries all of the above.. and it's listed as "buy now, pick up today"

sweet

Judman13

08-30-2008, 12:46 AM

YEah i was going to say most auto places carry alot of permatex stuff.

Looks like Permatex FTW!!!

kansei

08-30-2008, 12:49 AM

I'm going to have a new gasket (along with the fuel pump housing, the pre-filter sock, and misc o-rings and such related to the fuel pump) shipped to our phoenix address as soon as I know what said address will be :P

08-30-2008, 12:52 AM

something like a JB weld fuel tank repair putty. something you mix together, and then maybe roll and make a gasket outta it.

kansei

08-30-2008, 12:53 AM

something like a JB weld fuel tank repair putty. something you mix together, and then maybe roll and make a gasket outta it.

thanks I'll try to find a source for this

autozone has something similar "ITW Performance Polymers / 1 oz. Magnum Instant Gas Tank Repair": http://www.autozone.com/selectedZip,14620/initialAction,accessoryProductDetail/initialR,1370244/shopping/selectZip.htm

maybe pep boys has it, their web site is 100% useless though

Judman13

08-30-2008, 12:56 AM

haa get the Mighty Puddy!!!! those commercials are soo stupid!!!

ForceFed

08-30-2008, 01:05 AM

SOoo....What exactly is your problem here....Because I am not seeing it?

ANd BTW...RTV can be used near Fuel if its the right compound.

kansei

08-30-2008, 01:45 AM

SOoo....What exactly is your problem here....Because I am not seeing it?

ANd BTW...RTV can be used near Fuel if its the right compound.

you can't see the pic? Huge (and sudden) fuel leak, pulled off the access panel under the back seat and there's gasoline everywhere.

No RTV that I can find says that it is safe for fuel.

ForceFed

08-30-2008, 01:49 AM

I would hae to go look to see which one would work..but I think Black will IIRC.

I couldn't tell what that pis was of..It looked like grease to me...I thought it was road grime.

And what a wuss...Roll the windows down and roll....You have obioulsy never had an old Carbureted Car that needs a Tune up and Some noe Vacuum lines.
Or even a Bike....Motorcycles always leaeve me smelling like fuel.

Everything smells like gas...all the time.

Suck it up and Drive...LOL!

kansei

08-30-2008, 08:08 AM

I did just suck it up and drive from CT to Rochester (6+ hours) but it's a lot worse now (like near 10mpg).

Yeah the black RTV is as you described but check this thread: http://www.thirdgen.org/techboard/tech-general-engine/196890-will-rtv-sealent-stop.html

people seem to be in agreement that it'll dissolve.

DemonIAm

08-30-2008, 08:31 AM

Could you have it ordered and delivered to someone along the route, and just put up with it for a day or so?

man this really sucks. I hope you are planning on filing a compliant with the city/town

kansei

08-30-2008, 01:28 PM

it'd be a complaint with the state and unless I have proof that I was there when I say I was... what can I do?

I could have it ordered and delivered to Texas but I doubt I could make it that far. njaremka or liquid_ag can vouch for how strong the gas fumes are. I haven't been in the car for over an hour and I still have a really bad headache and feel like crap.

After calling dozens (2-3 dozen srsly) of shops to see if anyone could get it in, my car is at a Goodyear Gemini Service Center where they "might be able to look at it before the end of the day".

If it's just the fuel pump gasket they're going to get it out and apply a liquid gasket (I bought a few different ones and left them in the car for them to use). I'm still making a major assumption that the gasket is the problem, it may not be.

I don't have time to deal with it since we weren't able to get any of the fuel pump screws off. They're of course quite rusted, we can't even find a screwdriver that can fit in them at all. WTF why are these not just 10mm bolts??

ForceFed

08-30-2008, 01:37 PM

Did I miss it..or how is thi9s a States or Citys Problem?
Your blaming them for a failed gasket how?

DemonIAm

08-30-2008, 01:38 PM

what about the Dragon? maybe Brandella could meet you there?

I hope the shop can at least get you a temp fix!

DemonIAm

08-30-2008, 01:39 PM

Did I miss it..or how is thi9s a States or Citys Problem?
Your blaming them for a failed gasket how?

Shoddy road construction damaged his front sway, caused this gas leakage and other carnage...

edit Protege Blog post 6775 (http://www.themazdaforum.com/showpost.php?p=152851&postcount=6775) and the next 2-3 pages

sumo_bob

08-30-2008, 02:05 PM

what about your insurance company? I know that some rental companies do one way rentals

ForceFed

08-30-2008, 02:24 PM

ForceFed

08-30-2008, 02:24 PM

Either way..I hope you get it fixed enough for your trip....Sucks to hear no matter what.

kansei

08-30-2008, 03:07 PM

YEah..I am not seeing a connection with a shitty road contributing to a failed gasket like this...It may have jostled it enough to make it rear its ugly head...but that did not happen in a matter of seconds...Sorry.

hmm yeah all of this stuff happened immediately after that impact. It was enough to stall the engine, damage either the cam or crank position sensor (replaced both as I didn't have time to deal with it), broke a fog light (bulb + physically messed up), mangled a front sway bar bushing bracket (and the bushing is now missing), etc.

sucks more for my sister. she was following and her a/c compressor immediately seized

But since you brought it up, this thread is not for questioning why or how something broke, it's about getting it fixed. Also I talked to a couple shops and as soon as I mentioned the situation and that the smell was in the cabin as well at outside, the fuel pump gasket was the first thing suggested.

bazooka joe

08-30-2008, 04:25 PM

epic failure, that's all i can say! you'll get it fixed!

ForceFed

08-30-2008, 05:22 PM

Sorry..but a gasket doesn't totally fail from an impact as you describe.

IIRC..the thread actually is about whatyou can se for a temporary fix for this....And IIRC..Black RTV is Oil and Fuel resistant..so yeah..it would work temporarily I believe.

And you guys call me a whiner...Wow...whas this thread again?

And No bump caused a AC compressor to sieze..sorry.
Unless there was a DIRECT impact with the pulley.

Judman13

08-30-2008, 05:45 PM

how are you even sitting here calling chris a lair!! I mean come on if the A/c was working before, then after the shock from the bump the compressor wasn't running looks like it was the bumps fault!!! and if there was enough shock to tear up the swap bar bushing bracket and the crank/cam sensors. A tank filled with gas is pretty heavy and can carry a lot of momentum. So sudden change of direction like that could have cause the tank to shift, or something, making the gasket fail or just make a smaller problem worse.

ForceFed

08-30-2008, 06:01 PM

I am not calling him a liar..I am just telling you from my "PRofessional" exerience about AC systems that a "Bump" or a "Jolt" did not cause a COmpressor to fail.
This Does not mean it didnt knock a wire loose or something along those lines..but I gaurantee it did not have a Mechanical Failure form a Jolt unless there was a direct impact with the AC compressor itself.

Period.

kansei

08-30-2008, 09:33 PM

mzdalvr

08-30-2008, 09:58 PM

hey kansei, sorry i've been out all day. you might try this for a temp solution, Permatex makes these, but again this application is usually for leaks in steel tanks, but it might work in this case.

http://permatex.com/products/Automotive/specialized_maintenance_repair/radiator_fuel_tank_repair.htm

I'm still looking for a solution.

found this on: http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/fuel-resistant-gasket-maker-material-138135.html

"Permatex #2 is a pasty stuff that comes in a tube like toothpaste. It does stiffen up into a relatively non-gooey state. It never gets completely hard, just to the point that you can barely push a fingernail into it.

Permatex #3 is a thick liquid that comes in a plastic can with a brush under the lid. It's less stiff when it dries than the #2. You can paint some on a porous gasket, let it soak in for a few minutes, then paint a little more on just before installing the gasket. That gasket will peel off pretty much intact even years later, usually cleanly enough that another slathering will allow you to re-use the gasket for a few more years, as long as it's used on the same surface.

Neither is affected by gasoline, but either cleans off easily with alcohol."

I can't confirm this yet.

mzdalvr

08-30-2008, 10:05 PM

This thread is looking for help. RTV Black is oil resistant, not gasoline resistant.

The shop that said they might be able to take a look at it did take a look at it, then decided the "only feasible way" to get the screws out was to torch them, which well.. wouldn't at all be safe.

They said the tank will have to come down and be drained...

There is a way to remove the filter assy. then replace with OE gasket after cleaning it all up - unless buying a new filter as well. Temporary solution so at least you can drive it without leaking is priority. You also won't know how bad it is unless you can clean it a little. You can try to siphon it out from the filler cap if its full - dropping the tank is a bit of work and should require about 1/4 tank left otherwise its heavy and dangerous. My prior post describes temporary solutions to seal a leak, personally I'd try to clean the crud around the filter then take a pic - probably will make it easier to make a determination. Could be that the gasket is shifted and the bolts not torqued enough, or it could be that the gasket failed by being installed improperly - hard to tell.

Let me know if you need somethin' I'll try to find out all I can.

TheMAN

08-30-2008, 11:30 PM

any fucking reason you can't just rent a uhaul, stuff your whole apartment in it, and tow the piece of shit with it to AZ?

Judman13

08-30-2008, 11:39 PM

Haha could you even see chris driving a big ole freaking u-haul cross country?? No way i couldnt do that 3 hours if one of those things is too much!!!

TheMAN

08-30-2008, 11:58 PM

my parents did it 12 years ago... if you can't do it, then you're a wuss... too bad for you

Red5_02

08-31-2008, 12:10 AM

my parents did it 12 years ago... if you can't do it, then you're a wuss... too bad for you

you ever done it?

ForceFed

08-31-2008, 12:18 AM

Its driving...Its not complicated.

Red5_02

08-31-2008, 12:24 AM

Its driving...Its not complicated.

Oh I know, I've done it and I'm doing it again tomorrow. But if you don't wanna drive a big truck or aren't comfortable with it then you don't need some mouthy kid callin you a wuss.

RockinVs

08-31-2008, 08:51 AM

TheMAN

08-31-2008, 09:34 AM

Oh I know, I've done it and I'm doing it again tomorrow. But if you don't wanna drive a big truck or aren't comfortable with it then you don't need some mouthy kid callin you a wuss.
oh please... anyone forced to drive a uhaul WILL drive a uhaul... anyone who won't IS a wuss

TheMAN

08-31-2008, 09:38 AM

I've done the uhaul thing 3 times. (all over 1000 miles) I do know that moving to the south is mucho expensive with a uhaul. Everyone goes south.

Also, I believe Chris set up this thread to get help and give help on this situation, not have a bunch of people be douchbags to him. (at least forcefed warns u of this)

Anyways I believe that if said things were working before bad bump, than not after, then maybe, just maybe, by the powers of deduction, the bump caused said things to occur one way or the other.

Good luck Chris.

Not trying to be a douche myself here, or maybe I am, but just hoping people give him some constructive advice and less criticism.
so you call me telling him to drive a uhaul not constructive? he's the one whining that he HAS to be on the road today, not me... the uhual thing is the reliable way to get his ass out of dodge

it's obvious no one has been able to come up with a solution in time for his super rush... so he can't leave today, big fucking deal.... I don't see what the problem is of delaying the trip... it's retarded to even get on the road right now as obviously things are not safe

so are you calling me an asshole for telling him to get a uhaul? you know, all of you people are big sissy girls wearing their panties inside out any time I say some shit that is meaningful.... go fuck yourself if you're calling me an asshole for telling him to get a uhaul to get this quickly over with

SATimko

08-31-2008, 10:44 AM

Ya know what...if all you're going to do is come in here and spew a bunch of bullshit, being pissed off about God knows what, for absolutely no reason, then you can go back to 24/7 and do it all over the place. I don't give a fuck about your bitching, and I'm sure no one else does. I think it's time for this thread to be closed.

mzdalvr

08-31-2008, 10:55 AM

ForceFed

08-31-2008, 10:55 AM

I saw no BS....Where did you see that.

God..you guys are a bunch of babies.

And you guys say I bitch...do you guys ever read what you write??

TheMAN

08-31-2008, 10:57 AM

I see nothing but crying 5 year old GIRLS in this thread except for forcefed

grow some fucking skin fucktards

mzdalvr

08-31-2008, 10:58 AM

I saw no BS....Where did you see that.

God..you guys are a bunch of babies.

And you guys say I bitch...do you guys ever read what you write??

I see nothing but crying 5 year old GIRLS in this thread except for forcefed

grow some fucking skin fucktards

Well if your not part of the solution of this thread, your part of the problem. I really don't know how this thread got from helping our Kensei, to this other convo. Threadjack FTL

TheMAN

08-31-2008, 11:02 AM

there is obviously no solution to this other than replacing the parts to fix it
plus we have sketchy details on exactly what is broken... insufficient information means insufficient help

there's the old saying... "help me help you!"

it's obvious a patch job is epic FAIL, gets some sense in your fucking head that the only way for him to leave town NOW is to rent a uhaul or some truck that'll let him tow the protege... my suggestion was CONSTRUCTIVE, not stupid bullshit like "omg! loser!"

SATimko

08-31-2008, 11:03 AM

Umm...he's in fuckin Ohio now... uh so obviously it worked enough.

kansei

08-31-2008, 11:13 AM

*yawn* oh hello there.

Yeah Edwin I looked into u-haul months ago, but it was going to cost 3-4k + gas (at what.. 10-12mpg) + whatever they charge for the equipment to tow my car. I fit everything I needed right in my Protege5, though I didn't want to. The original plan was to drive a basically empty car and ship all my stuff, but alas the apartment place won't sign for the packages (weird).

And yes, my information on the problem is sorta vague because of course I don't know exactly what is wrong. I didn't have time to drop the tank and check, I had to move out. Rent was paid through the end of August so I couldn't just hang around longer in Rochester. Plus with the time it takes to get to Arizona, and Rob starting work the monday after we get to AZ, couldn't really postpone. Trust me, I'd love to fork over money to just have the car fixed right now, but with the holiday weekend it isn't possible.

The earliest I can get the gasket (if that is in fact the problem, again I'm not sure but that looks like where the gas is coming from) is Wednesday.

It was just absolutely terrible timing for this to happen, but oh well not much I can do about it. Fuel economy isn't the normal 32-36mpg highway, but then again Rob isn't getting anywhere near that either, and my car is even more loaded down than his.

I'm still working on my options. The U-Haul was going to be overkill since I didn't need that much space at all (and don't have the cash since I just graduated).. the other option was to get rid of the car and get a Miata, but I did look and it isn't possible to find a non-rusted out one around the Northeast.

Thanks for the suggestions and such everyone, I hope I can get this fixed ASAP --just drove a little over 8 hours to get to satimko's place, 1am-9am, and it was really cold with the windows down the whole way ha.

ForceFed

08-31-2008, 11:15 AM

, gets some sense in your head that the only way for him to leave town NOW is to rent a uhaul or some truck that'll let him tow the protege... my suggestion was CONSTRUCTIVE, not stupid bullshit like "omg! loser!"
He is right..He provided a Constructive soultion to the problem...I dont even like the man most of the time....but He got banned for what exactly?

Wow...

kansei

08-31-2008, 11:19 AM

Well I didn't say his suggestion wasn't constructive. Trust me, it's an option I considered months ago when my car wasn't having any problems at all. It was just crazy expensive and driving a u-haul across the country = not fun. I was going to go with ABF U-Pack or one of the pod companies instead so my stuff could get there and I could still have a blast driving my car across the country.

ForceFed

08-31-2008, 11:26 AM

I understand that..so exactly why did he get his ban..I think it ridiculous.

Just because you dont like the way he put it...It still was constructive..and you have some other member provoking him.

I dont know why I am even typing this....your only going to see things the way you want anyway....

As usual.

ForceFed

08-31-2008, 11:28 AM

Umm...he's in fuckin Ohio now... uh so obviously it worked enough.

This response...was totally iuncalled for..and worse than any other in the thread...Way to be counter-productive....

And BTW..now my post talking about your post is worthless as well...Damn.:screwy:

kansei

08-31-2008, 11:30 AM

Just because you dont like the way he put it...

Well that's the thing. Sure it's the internet and people do enjoy the "it's the internet I can say whatever I want" mentality but we try to foster a positive and helpful community here. Hence, if someone is just being offensive and starting crap in almost every thread they post in, something has to be done. Edwin has been warned tons of times, but don't worry, he's not permanently banned or anything. It's just a temp ban "slap on the wrist". He has his own forum (www.imazda.com) if he wants to say whatever he wants :)