232.1whp@8.1psi

[PHRiSCo]

From July 06, 2004, maybe June 07th?? :)

http://www.cohoethefish.com/images/PHRiSCo_Dyno_070604_01.jpg

1) Before the MAM Tubular Exhaust Manifold.
2) Before the overbore 8.5:1 MAM short block.

[Ken@ProtegeGarage]

those are some very good numbers for 8 psi

[Peepsalot]

Oh schnapps! What mods did you have done at time of dyno?

[Aric]

how big of a turbo?

[PHRiSCo]

Engine mods at time of Dyno:

Kinetic Motorsport Front Mount Intercooler /w Spearco Core
Kinetic Motorsport Stainless Steel Hard Pipes
Kinetic Motorsport Stainless Steel Cold Air Intake /w K&N Filter
Kinetic Motorsport 3" Downpipe-Back Exhaust
Modern Performance Inc. Piggyback Air/Fuel/Timing Controller
Dual 42lb Bosch Injectors
AWR Urethane Motor Mounts
GReddy Profec B Electronic Boost Controller
GReddy Turbo Timer

Stock Transmission and Components...
Stock Turbo...

You can see what is there now in my signature link, I'll still be running stock turbo with the MAM short block.

[PHRiSCo]

Here's the extra info...

http://www.cohoethefish.com/images/PHRiSCo_Dyno_070604_02.jpg
http://www.cohoethefish.com/images/PHRiSCo_Dyno_070604_03.jpg

I'll be turning up the boost once everything is running again.

[Bigg Tim]

didn't that guy only run 1 xtra injector and didn't he get over 240whp at 8psi until he blew? I thought I remembered him making more, it was very impressive.

[BRIAN MP5T]

Pretty Cool #

[vindication]

wow, nice numbers there man. go to the track with it?

[PHRiSCo]

I've done a few lapping days with Morrisport. www.morrisport.com.

I've only taken it to a 1/8th drag day once, but I couldn't win a race I was against like 50s Fords and 60s Chevys with slicks. I couldn't get no traction and although my slips always said I was going much faster then my opponent at the end of the race I just couldn't grip at launch haha.

edit: Cool I'm in this picture 3rd from the front on the left. http://www.morrisport.com/perfectlap_mission.html

[daedalus]

nice #!'s... you have one of the nicest msp's on here. I love what you did with the hood and the wheels... color combo ties in perfect. Props to you!

[terbow]

You dont need the extra injectors, i was running 11.5 psi and still wasnt lean @ 11.3 afr. Id say 12 and over you should get em tho. but thats just from my car.

nick recommends 1 extra injector at 8 psi and 10 and above 2 injectors. maybe thats y he has them.

[PHRiSCo]

It's good I did that though, cause my new MAM shortblock is going in this week, but I'm still not upgrading the turbo, I hoping to run 12-14 psi.

I've blown 2 engines, so I'd like to have the car for at least a year without upgrading the turbo and running 20 pounds.

[terbow]

Just curious? How do u blow 2 engines at 8 psi?

[PHRiSCo]

I was running 505Zooms's MPI map when I blew it. We have basically the exact same setup so I'd like to think I was being safe by running rich.

Turns out my block wasn't strong enough.

The maps for this dyno we're done by the Kinetic guys, I'm sure they still have the maps somewhere on their labtop. If I find it I'll post the screenshots.

[terbow]

interesting.

[PHRiSCo]

BTW I'm sure I was running this map when I blew(exploded) my stock engine in August 2004, although I was fucking around a bit and had turned up the boost to 11psi or so.

So it probably wasn't the safest setup, but I'll say it again, it is what it is.

[terbow]

After the first blew didnt you try to find out what it was so you didnt blow another or was this all just bad luck with defects.

[PHRiSCo]

I know what it is, my goddamn Greddy Profec that I can't keep my hands off of hahaha.

[terbow]

I know what it is, my goddamn Greddy Profec that I can't keep my hands off of hahaha.

yea those are the devil.

[505zoom]

I was running 505Zooms's MPI map when I blew it. We have basically the exact same setup so I'd like to think I was being safe by running rich.

Hmm... I don't believe I ever sent the actual map file, because up until the last software update I couldn't save my maps or datalogs. IIRC, I just took some screen shots of the fuel and timing tables to give you guys the right idea, but those numbers needed fine tuning for your setup. I thought you told me that it needed quite a bit of changing to run good on your car though?

See now ya got me feelin bad because this is the exact reason that I hadn't ever given out any of my maps to anyone before I did that for you, haha. Now it's gonna cost ya more than a discount on tiger woods to get my new one...(shady) And in all honesty, I am starting to wonder why you would even want it if my old one blew your shit up.:p

[terbow]

Dont feel bad, when you go user tuneable ems its the users fault if they blow it up. no discounts for j00!

[daedalus]

Phrisco just a little fyi... 12psi on this turbo is nothing... its what i'm running everyday and the car is pretty fucking ballsy. I plan on upping the boost once i get rid of the car in a couple of weeks and turning it up to about 14lbs. I'm also on a MAM shortblock. Anything higher than 14 psi and youre really just blowing a lot of hot air. Its past the effeciency range on the stock turbo and its just going to spike your EGT's like a mofo.

Anyway... yay for two built msp's maxing out the potenial of the stock turbo.

[moeed]

Phrisco, nice numbers, my setup is close to your, except I got a J&S, a custom exhaust thats 3" turbo back, and the mpnick upgrade. Need to dyno sometime when i get time out of school.

[Bigg Tim]

Those numbers can be attainable. Where you running C16? How about spraying the intercooler? Did you have a lot of timing in? Or maybe an exhaust cutout? If he was doing any or all of those, then those numbers on an aggressive tune are feasable. And also, at that POWER level, he would need more fuel then what the stock ECU can give. IIRC, when he put in the xtra injector, he was able to get more power because he had more fuel.

I made 226whp @ 8psi, yeah it was a bigger turbo but it was not very aggressive. I him give props for taking it to the limit and showing what a little tuning and "tricks" can do!!

[pdhaudio83]

Cleaned thread up. Guys, we are a community full of enthusiats. Please stop antagonizing.

[505zoom]

I made 200.3whp/213.7wtq with his same mods, and boosting only max 7.5psi for the run (settled closer to 6 at the max whp point)... on a dynojet... so I don't really see too big of a deal here.

His boost hit 10psi, and settled to 8... 232whp.
My boost hit 7.5psi, and settled to 6... 200.3whp.

Figure roughly 10-12whp per psi, and he is only making an estimated 10 extra whp than I did on a dynojet... now factor in the difference in dynos, and the numbers are fine. Maybe a little high because of the type of dyno it was done on, but a lot of you guys are treating this like he is claiming something totally ridiculous here when he isn't.

Go run it down the track or slap it on a dynojet to get some numbers that make everyone happy.:)

[BRIAN MP5T]

It's good I did that though, cause my new MAM shortblock is going in this week, but I'm still not upgrading the turbo, I hoping to run 12-14 psi.

I've blown 2 engines, so I'd like to have the car for at least a year without upgrading the turbo and running 20 pounds.


You might want to think that one a bit.. The Blue Dots represent 7000RPM on the FS. Notice that 15 Psi is on the outside of the Red Graph.
http://www.msprotege.com/members/Brian%20MP5T/New%20Stuff%20For%20UL%20-%20(18).jpg

[METAL]

You might want to think that one a bit..
http://www.msprotege.com/members/Brian%20MP5T/New%20Stuff%20For%20UL%20-%20(18).jpg



a bit out of efficientcy there



the 28,looks like it's damn near made for the car.

[BRIAN MP5T]

All dots will shift a bit to the left if they were representing 6500 RPM, so Yes, you are correct.

[PHRiSCo]

Oh I will upgrade the turbo eventually, just not now.

I was under the impression dyno jets are crap that's why everyone has em, they are half or a quarter of the price of a dyno dynamics, because apparently dynojets aren't accurate.

Although I have no proof to back this up.

When the engine is worn in a little and all tuned up I'll find a dynojet somewhere, don't hold your breath though, maybe summer time?

[pdhaudio83]

(thumb)

nice work on the extra power, whether its 100% accurate, or not.

[505zoom]

...I'd like to have the car for at least a year without upgrading the turbo and running 20 pounds.

I can tell you first hand that the stock turbo will not stand up to 20psi for a year or more. Mine gave up after 3 weekends of running it that high, and to be perfectly honest, it didn't feel any faster at 20 than it did at 18. Some people say that it runs out of gas at 15, but I don't think that's 100% true. If you want my opinion on it, then I say run it at 18 spike 16 hold as the max. That will be a good tradeoff that will keep your turbo alive and functioning, but still be pushing it near it's limit.

Oh and a little OT, but I found the power cord for the computer, so I can finally link up and get the new map off of there. I am going to stress more heavily this time though that you guys need to use it as a base, at lower boost, and fine tune it for you car. I am not confident with just giving you the map and you running it with no adjustments at higher boost levels. I am using it to run 14psi on the 28RS now, but I still want you guys to start out at like 10, monitor the AFR and adjust, THEN bump the boost up by 1psi per run making sure that there are no lean spots. I would also go ahead and retard a little more timing out for the initial runs until you are sure that the fuel is where it needs to be. If I don't get it to you tonight, shoot me a IM and remind me tomorrow to go snag it for you.

[PHRiSCo]

You misunderstood me Rich.

I know the stock turbo is weak.

What I was saying is that I'd like to have the car for over a year after this new engine goes in, run 12-14psi, and not worry about more power.

August 2004 - Christmas 2004 - No car blew engine.
October 2005 - This Week? - No car blew engine.
February 2006 - Spring 2007 - Good car no problems.

I'll re-word what I said. Before I upgrade the turbo and run 20psi, I'm gonna stick with the stock turbo for awhile and run max boost on the T25.

Better? :)

[BRIAN MP5T]

Max Boost is 15 Dude.. Even that is high IMO..

[PHRiSCo]

yeah, I know, are my posts that confusing?

Or are you making fun of me because I said max 14psi? haha

Now I'm confused.

[PHRiSCo]

*sniff*

Red just showed up on Andy's beach, brings a tear to my eye everytime.

[Peepsalot]

edit: moving my comment to the compressor map thread.

[BRIAN MP5T]

How did you figure those dots? Shouldn't they be in a perfect line?

Remember in Science class when you plotted a graph, you would leve the dots where they were and plot a line that followed the Average...

That is where the line should lie.

[505zoom]

*sniff*

Red just showed up on Andy's beach, brings a tear to my eye everytime.

Haha, I think this boy's 'bout to have a little accident.

[Bigg Tim]

I made 200.3whp/213.7wtq with his same mods, and boosting only max 7.5psi for the run (settled closer to 6 at the max whp point)... on a dynojet... so I don't really see too big of a deal here.

His boost hit 10psi, and settled to 8... 232whp.
My boost hit 7.5psi, and settled to 6... 200.3whp.

Figure roughly 10-12whp per psi, and he is only making an estimated 10 extra whp than I did on a dynojet... now factor in the difference in dynos, and the numbers are fine. Maybe a little high because of the type of dyno it was done on, but a lot of you guys are treating this like he is claiming something totally ridiculous here when he isn't.

Go run it down the track or slap it on a dynojet to get some numbers that make everyone happy.:)

It may also not be a dyno difference. Was the intercooler being iced or something? Was it race fuel? Real aggressive tune? Any of those factors would yield higher numbers. No matter what, he definatly show'd what the stock little snail can do when pushed.

PHRiS--what about reworking the stock turbo and saving a grand? A reworked sotck turbo from Nick made over 330whp at a steady 15psi because the WG spring wouldn't let him stay at 18psi. This was with C16, exhaust cutout and an intercooler sprayer. So the reworked turbo is cheaper and will still yield a ton of power. I know, people will argue the 28rs is better. I am not saying it is or isn't, just throwing out that info because it is cheaper to do and you will still net some great numbers.

[505zoom]

Uhm, how do you figure that you save a grand by doing a MPNick upgrade instead of a 28RS?

Let's see, 550ish for the upgrade, and you get nothing back from selling your stocker... or spend 950 on a 28RS and sell the stock unit for anything up to 300.

One way you are spending roughly 550, and the other way you are spending about 650... definitely no 1k difference.

[PHRiSCo]

Well I'm not doing anything unless it cost me $50 or so now, I'm moving this month and paying for an engine it's a little pricy.

I have some pretty good ins with some turbo dealers anyhow, and I figure picking up a new turbo and selling my old one will be a pretty good deal.

Thanks for the advice, I will look into it when the time comes.

[BRIAN MP5T]

Oh My. I think the upgrade can wait, nobody is holding a 20 Psi Gun to your head. Get the build out of the way and then you can worry about the "Upgrade"

[METAL]

it's not really about what the correct # of HP your car makes,dyno jet #s are good because they are the most common making them comparible.

so even if your dyno was more accurate,it was't measured the same way most are,making it hard to tell if it's where it should be or it's better.

ya dig?




Oh I will upgrade the turbo eventually, just not now.

I was under the impression dyno jets are crap that's why everyone has em, they are half or a quarter of the price of a dyno dynamics, because apparently dynojets aren't accurate.

Although I have no proof to back this up.

When the engine is worn in a little and all tuned up I'll find a dynojet somewhere, don't hold your breath though, maybe summer time?

[METAL]

Oh My. I think the upgrade can wait, nobody is holding a 20 Psi Gun to your head. Get the build out of the way and then you can worry about the "Upgrade"



needs to break in the engine anyway.

[BRIAN MP5T]

needs to break in the engine anyway.
:)